[adcom] Re: [statecom-discuss] gr response to the recent round of terror

Fri Jul 21 04:26:54 EDT 2006

Actually Colby, what "everyone else does" is to criticize the strong and the weak, the invader and the defender  equally when boith sides are not equal....

-----Original Message-----
>From: "Colby E. Peterson" <saphron at verizon.net>
>Sent: Jul 20, 2006 10:06 PM
>To: Discussion List for StateCom members <statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org>
>Subject: Re: [adcom] Re: [statecom-discuss] gr response to the recent round of	terror
>
>I won't participate in allowing this party to continue to be victims  
>of Zionist media destruction because we aren't willing to broadly  
>condemn violence.
>
>The reason we are on the defensive all the time is because we are not  
>willing to apply equal principles to opposing parties. I am tired of  
>fighting with outsiders (who are definitely reading all of this right  
>now) about how a "peace party" is not readily prepared to criticize  
>all violence. We are not criticizing anyone when we "call all parties  
>to end violence and come about to a solution peacefully." How can you  
>not support that? I'm tired of doing what everyone else does-  
>romanticizing some or any movement when we know that peace and  
>diplomacy is the only ultimate solution to this problem. We can state  
>who's right and who's wrong based on our platform, but I am not going  
>to sit by and let us become known as "the party that supports  
>terrorism."
>
>- Colby
>
>
>
>On Jul 20, 2006, at 9:54 PM, david rolde wrote:
>
>> The resistance are defending the people using the
>> means they believe are necessary. I won't participate
>> in criticizing Palestinian or Lebanese resistance
>> movements. - David
>>
>> --- "Colby E. Peterson" <saphron at verizon.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Yo, just one more thing!
>>>
>>>> Most importantly I object to us placing any
>>> demands on
>>>> Hizballah or the Palestinians such as Colby's
>>>> sentence: "We call on all parties to reopen
>>>> discussions  immediately and to stop escalating
>>>> violence in the region." The violence is entirely
>>> the
>>>> fault of the Zionist entity. We cannot place any
>>> blame
>>>> on people for defending themselves from brutal
>>> racist
>>>> colonial expansionist occupation.
>>>
>>> Yes, we all know how brutal and racist Israel is,
>>> that's what this
>>> statement is about. But we don't place the same
>>> demands (or "calls",
>>> as Bill put it better) on all parties, then we are
>>> not being fair,
>>> and we are implicitly aligning ourselves with those
>>> who would use
>>> violence to achieve their goals. That is a bad
>>> situation for us to be
>>> in. I urge us to reinsert the language that calls
>>> for a "non-violent"
>>> solution to this war- that's what we really care
>>> about, right, the
>>> end of fatalities?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 20, 2006, at 6:17 PM, david rolde wrote:
>>>
>>>> annie's statement isn't perfect. But in some ways
>>> I
>>>> like it better than Colby's. I have serious
>>> concerns
>>>> with parts of Colby's statement.
>>>>
>>>> Most importantly I object to us placing any
>>> demands on
>>>> Hizballah or the Palestinians such as Colby's
>>>> sentence: "We call on all parties to reopen
>>>> discussions  immediately and to stop escalating
>>>> violence in the region." The violence is entirely
>>> the
>>>> fault of the Zionist entity. We cannot place any
>>> blame
>>>> on people for defending themselves from brutal
>>> racist
>>>> colonial expansionist occupation.
>>>>
>>>> The reason for using quotes on the word "Israel"
>>> is
>>>> because the word "Israel" and the word "Palestine"
>>>> refer to the same location. The nation of
>>> Palestine is
>>>> occupied by a colonial power that is trying to
>>> wipe
>>>> out the indigenous population and change the very
>>> name
>>>> of the country to reflect the identiy of the
>>>> colonizers. It is offensive to use the word
>>> "Israel"
>>>> to refer to all or part of the nation of Palestine
>>>> without some sort of disclaimer or explanation.
>>> Using
>>>> quotation marks around the word "Israel" is an
>>> easy
>>>> way to avoid the racist mislabelling of the
>>> country.
>>>> But perhaps the reason for the use of the
>>> quotation
>>>> marks is not clear to all readers, and an
>>> explanation
>>>> of the situation may be a necessary addition to
>>> the
>>>> statement.
>>>>
>>>> As to the dismantling of "Israel". Our statement
>>> on
>>>> Palestine says, "The Green-Rainbow Party of
>>>> Massachusetts rejects all apartheid-based
>>> governmental
>>>> systems and calls for a secular, democratic
>>> governing
>>>> entity for all people in the geographic region of
>>>> historic Palestine (today referred to by some
>>> people
>>>> as Israel, the West Bank and Gaza). We support a
>>>> democratic system with equal rights for all in
>>> which
>>>> the peoples of the region democratically decide
>>> their
>>>> future." Clearly "Israel" is a racist apartheid
>>> state
>>>> whose laws are based on one interpretation of the
>>>> Jewish religion (anti-Zionist Jews consider it to
>>> be a
>>>> terrible misinterpretation). So "Israel" as it
>>> exists
>>>> now needs to be dismantled in order for a truly
>>>> democratic government to come into existence in
>>>> Palestine. For clarity this could be explained in
>>> the
>>>> statement rather than just saying "dismantle
>>> 'Israel'"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Anyway, I started writing this email on Tuesday
>>> and
>>>> stopped in the middle because I had to leave to go
>>> to
>>>> the Communications Committee meeting. I hadn't
>>>> finished stating all my concerns with Colby's
>>> draft.
>>>> But in the meantime I have written another draft
>>>> statement based on Colby and annie's statements
>>> with a
>>>> lot of changes and additions.  I  honored the
>>> request
>>>> to not put "Israel" in quotes all the time and to
>>> make
>>>> specific demands for justice in all of Palestine
>>>> rather than simply calling for the state of Israel
>>> to
>>>> be dismantled. And I guess I wrote a draft without
>>>> using the word terror or terrorism or terrorist.
>>> Maybe
>>>> we should add something about state terrorism as
>>> Bill
>>>> suggests. Actually I'll quickly add that in and we
>>> can
>>>> see if Colby has concerns about it. I'll send my
>>> draft
>>>> in the next email.  - David
>>>>
>>>> --- BillCunningham <etwee at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I agree with Colby's point 2.
>>>>>
>>>>> As to point 1, a terrorist act is not hard to
>>>>> define. We should find some way to say how Israel
>>>>> and the US are twisting words to justify a policy
>>> of
>>>>> State terror in the strictest sense of the word.
>>>>>
>>>>> As to point 3, it is true that this would be a
>>> new
>>>>> position. But to dismantle Israel clearly refers
>>> to
>>>>> a State. I don't see that we have ever said
>>> anything
>>>>> about a secular State.
>>>>>
>>>>> We must find some way to respond to events more
>>>>> quickly. Our process is not very inspiring for
>>>>> people who might otherwise rally to our banner.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: "Colby E. Peterson" <saphron at verizon.net>
>>>>>> Sent: Jul 15, 2006 11:14 PM
>>>>>> To: BillCunningham <etwee at earthlink.net>,
>>>>> Discussion List for StateCom members
>>>>> <statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [statecom-discuss] gr response to
>>> the
>>>>> recent round of terror
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My disagreements with Annie's text (which I did
>>> use
>>>>> some parts from
>>>>>> since I think some of it was good):
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. I disagree with the use of the word
>>> "terrorist."
>>>>> Us labeling
>>>>>> anyone a terrorist is just as bad as our
>>> opponents
>>>>> labeling anyone
>>>>>> terrorists, which is a term that is used to
>>> inflame
>>>>> emotions due to
>>>>>> its all too vague definition at this point.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. I disagree with the use of quotations marks
>>> when
>>>>> referring to
>>>>>> Israel. Israel is not an idea, it is a place
>>> where
>>>>> real people live.
>>>>>> Some of us may disagree with its existence, what
>>> we
>>>>> cannot credibly
>>>>>> deny its very existence. It also changes the
>>> tone
>>>>> of the statement
>>>>>> and makes it less professional-reading against
>>> our
>>>>> advantage.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. I do not agree with the specific call to
>>>>> "dismantle Israel," as
>>>>>> our goal has not specifically been to dismantle
>>> the
>>>>> people that make
>>>>>> a nation, but our ultimate goal is for ALL
>>> peoples
>>>>> in the historic
>>>>>> Palestine region to be treated equally and not
>>>>> under an oppressed
>>>>>> system of apartheid, which we have defined as a
>>>>> secular government.
>>>>>> This may mean that Israel is inadvertently
>>>>> disassembled, but it may
>>>>>> follow a different scenario to equal rights and
>>> the
>>>>> end of oppression
>>>>>> similar to South Africa where the country stayed
>>>>> but the groups were
>>>>>> effectively integrated, but I do not think we
>>>>> should state that
>>>>>> Israel be disassembled at this time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Those are my concerns.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Colby
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 15, 2006, at 5:46 PM, BillCunningham
>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> These two responses don't seem so different to
>>>>> me. Would Colby
>>>>>>> explain why he doesn't agree with annie's text?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Mike sent out a series of statements by
>>> Democrat
>>>>> politicians in
>>>>>>> support of Israel. I think that annie's
>>> statement
>>>>> shows a point-by-
>>>>>>> point refutation of those Democrat statements,
>>>>> showing that the
>>>>>>> truth of the matter is the exact reverse of the
>>>>> Israel/Democrat
>>>>>>> position.... Would annie agree to have us quote
>>>>> each Dem statement
>>>>>>> and follow it by her corresponding statement?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: "Colby E. Peterson"
>>> <saphron at verizon.net>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Jul 15, 2006 9:59 AM
>>>>>>>> To: "Green-Rainbow Party (GRP) Administrative
>>>>> Committee"
>>>>>>>> <adcom at green-rainbow.org>, Discussion List for
>>>>> StateCom members
>>>>>>>> <statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org>
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [statecom-discuss] gr response to
>>>>> the recent round of
>>>>>>>> terror
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My proposed language for a response:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 	The Green-Rainbow Party has in the past
>>>>> affirmed in Palestine's
>>>>>>>> right to defend itself from an illegal
>>>>> occupation and the illegal
>>>>>>>> actions of Israel. We today reaffirm that
>>>>> Palestine has that right,
>>>>>>>> and we stand with the oppressed. We find
>>>>> Israel's actions to be out
>>>>>>>> of line with international law and, in terms
>>> of
>>>>> a response to the
>>>>>>>> capture of a handful of soldiers, completely
>>>>> disproportionate in
>>>>>>>> scale. We find the deliberate bombing of
>>>>> civilian infrastructure and
>>>>>>>> the death of civilians to be war crimes, and
>>>>> call on Israel to cease
>>>>>>>> any and all offensives immediately and leave
>>>>> Palestinian and Lebanese
>>>>>>>> territory forever. We call on all parties to
>>>>> reopen discussions
>>>>>>>> immediately and to stop escalating violence in
>>>>> the region.
>>>>>>>> 	The Green-Rainbow Party repeats its call on
>>> all
>>>>> invested parties,
>>>>>>>> including the United States, to divest from or
>>>>> cease foreign aid to
>>>>>>>> Israel immediately to stop funding of the
>>>>> killing of civilians, the
>>>>>>>> destruction of property, and the perpetuation
>>> of
>>>>> an apartheid
>>>>>>>> society.
>>>>>>>> 	Those who finance, direct, or otherwise
>>> support
>>>>> acts like these
>>>>>>>> need to understand that they have produced an
>>>>> extremely dangerous
>>>>>>>> situation and that they are responsible for
>>> the
>>>>> consequences. We call
>>>>>>>> on the UN and international community to take
>>>>> action to stop the
>>>>>>>> bloodshed and condemn and then sanction Israel
>>>>> for its illegal
>>>>>>>> actions.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jul 15, 2006, at 8:37 AM, annie butler
>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> and now for our response.  i hope it sounds
>>>>> familiar since i used
>>>>>>>>> the words our duly elected as the outline for
>>>>> the text below.  does
>>>>>>>>> statecom respond, ad com, mrgra...all of us?
>>>>> annie
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> At a time when Palestine finds itself under
>>>>> occupation and attack
>>>>>>>>> by forces funded and supplied by the United
>>>>> States, the Green
>>>>>>>>> Rainbow Party of Massachusettes  stands
>>>>> shoulder-to-shoulder with
>>>>>>>>> Palestinians in support of its right to
>>> defend
>>>>> itself and people
>>>>>>>>> from terrorist and militant attacks.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The Green Rainbow leadership strongly
>>> condemns
>>>>> the bombing of the
>>>>>>>>> Lebonese airport  by soldiers bought and paid
>>>>> for with our tax
>>>>>>>>> dollars.  Countries with influence over
>>>>> "Israel", particularly the
>>>>>>>>> United States, must move quickly to bring
>>> about
>>>>> the end of the
>>>>>>>>> current round of rocket attacks in Gaza and
>>>>> positions in Lebanon.
>>>>>>>>> Those who finance, direct, or otherwise
>>> support
>>>>> acts like these
>>>>>>>>> need to understand that they have produced an
>>>>> extremely dangerous
>>>>>>>>> situation and that they are responsible for
>>> the
>>>>> consequences.
>>>>>>>>> Palestine, and now Lebanon, have an inherent
>>>>> right to self defense.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Today's attacks by "Israel" into Lebanese
>>>>> territory were
>>>>>>>>> disgraceful and unwarranted acts of violence
>>> by
>>>>> a terrorist
>>>>>>>>> organization. "Israel" must release any
>>>>> captured civilians or
>>>>>>>>> soldiers immediately. "Israel" must be
>>>>> dismantled, and all nations
>>>>>>>>> have an obligation to
>>>>>>>>> cease any and all assistance to this
>>> terrorist
>>>>> organization.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If the world is serious about peace in the
>>>>> Middle East, then
>>>>>>>>> "Israel" needs to be held accountable for
>>>>> feeding, fostering, and
>>>>>>>>> unleashing, rabid, blood-spattered killers.
>>> The
>>>>> money, weapons and
>>>>>>>>> political support "Israel" receives the
>>> United
>>>>> States is  not
>>>>>>>>> uncontrollable or a natural phenomena and the
>>>>> international
>>>>>>>>> community must demand that they stop.
>>>>> Cross-border attacks on any
>>>>>>>>> country by "Israel" should result in tough
>>>>> international sanctions,
>>>>>>>>> and the UN Security Council should
>>> immediately
>>>>> pursue this option.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> statecom-discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>>> statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://www.green-rainbow.org/mailman/listinfo/statecom-discuss
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> statecom-discuss mailing list
>>>>>>>> statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://www.green-rainbow.org/mailman/listinfo/statecom-discuss
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bill Cunningham
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> statecom-discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://www.green-rainbow.org/mailman/listinfo/statecom-discuss
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Bill Cunningham
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> statecom-discuss mailing list
>>>>> statecom-discuss at green-rainbow.org
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> http://www.green-rainbow.org/mailman/listinfo/statecom-discuss
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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Bill Cunningham